Siglinde Skysworn

Sargatanas (Aether)

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  • 8

[E7S] Thinking With PORTALS!

The Journey into Savage 26
A casual scrub's raiding misadventures

I spent most of the 26th, Wednesday, reclearing E5S and E6S. It was surprisingly hard, as PF strats were not unified yet, and many groups had inconsistent execution. I was to blame too, after spending the entire weekend learning E6S, I actually forgot some basic things in E5S. I'm very sorry!

Eventually, I got my clears, only to run into a busy period at work. For 4 long days, I was not able to play Savage.

During this time, I studied guides for E7S when I had some free time. Everyone said it was easy, and some even claimed that it is easier than E6S. Of course, these claims always came with a condition: "If you know how to do portals."

If you have done E7, you have seen the mechanic of birds and colored portals. In normal mode, you have time to look at the gates and think about which gate will shoot first. However, in Savage, the gates quickly shoot 3 times. It's too fast. We need an algorithm, a set of rules that will tell us how to move. This battle will be won or lost before we set foot inside the instance.

Walking through the logic of the mechanic was surprisingly fun. I have included my thought process and solutions below, but it is quite long, so they are hidden for those who are not interested in the details. These are mechanics spoilers for E7S, so definitely don't see them if you want to do the fight blind.

Click to showClick to hide
Observant raiders noticed some clues. 1st, there are only 2 patterns of firing.

This means we can use this pair of safe tiles to do the mechanic, and only move north and south between them. We use this pair of tiles because they are out of the way of the portals firing from the north, allowing us to pay attention to the horizontal gates only.

2nd, the initial gates that spawn at the south are fixed. (I realized this as in Lil Cairn's video, he did not turn the camera around.) The west gate is red, and the east gate blue. The eastern horizontal gates are also always fixed, and the birds always fly from the east to the west, never in the other direction. The far NE gate is always red, and the gates next to it alternate colors. 

All we need to do is stand in front of the gate that shoots 2nd, wait for the 1st gate to go off, then move before it. If the birds flew into the red gate first, then the blue gate, they will emerge from the east in the same order. Since the red gate is north, and the blue gate is south, we move S -> N, like this:

And if the birds flew into the blue gate first, we move N -> S, like this.

But the mechanic quickly repeats 3 times. Will we be able to think fast enough to do it? In fact, it is very easy, because we only need to consider 2 situations. That is, whether the birds are flying into the same color gate they emerged from, or different colored gates. We'll call these situations "same gates" and "different gates".

If the gate shoots into the same color gate, the birds emerge in the same sequence, so the movement is the same. Otherwise, the movement is reversed. Because the NE gate is always red, we only need to look at the color of the NW gate to tell if it is "same gates" or "different gates", which makes it even easier. Further more, if the birds flew into the red gate first, we know the initial movement is from south to north, and vice versa.

In conclusion:

Red 1st: move S -> N
Blue 1st: move N -> S

Same gates = same movement
Opposite gates = opposite movement

This works in Normal mode, too!

This mechanic appears again in p3 with the astral and umbral debuffs. These require you to stand in a beam of the opposite color to the buff you have, and after being hit, it swaps the color of your buff! Again, I have included my thought process and solutions below.

Click to showClick to hide
While the different colors sound complicated, if you think about it, it just means that we want to be hit by a different colored beam every time.

Again, we consider the 2 cases of "same gates" and "different gates" as above. If same colored gates shoot into each other, then the beams that emerge from them the next time will be of identical color. In such a case, we should swap safe tiles. If it is different gates, then we should stay in the same tile instead. Easy! 

But wait! The gates fire 3 times horizontally, and after the 2nd time, a puddle appears on you that changes the color of your debuff.

While this was probably added to throw off players, it actually simplifies the mechanic for us. The reason is that the firing pattern of the gates can alternate only once. For example, here is a possible firing pattern:

1st gates: Same
2nd gates: Same
3rd gates: Different


1st gates: Same
2nd gates: Different
3rd gates: Different

The game never gives you a pattern of same-different-same, for example, because that alternates the firing pattern twice.

One way of thinking about the puddle that appears on you is, it reverses the situation for the 3rd set of gates, because your color will become the opposite of what it is supposed to be. 

* * *

Let's take the 1st case above:

1st gates: Same
2nd gates: Same
3rd gates: Different

However, the puddle appears after the 2nd gates, and reverses the situation for the 3rd gates. This means we should actually move as if the gates were firing like this:

1st gates: Same
2nd gates: Same
3rd gates: Same

And stand in the same time from start to end.

* * *

How about the other case? Let's consider if the situation was this:

1st gates: Same
2nd gates: Different
3rd gates: Different

The puddle reverses the situation for the 3rd gates, making it:

1st gates: Same
2nd gates: Different
3rd gates: Same

In other words, the safe tile will alternate (e.g. N-S-N). 

So, we only really need to pay attention to the 1st set of beams coming out, and the rest of the mechanic is solved for us.

In conclusion:

If you started west, go S.
If you started east, go N.

Look at the NW portal and see if the situation is "same gates" or "different gates".

Same gates = opposite tile
Opposite gates = same tile

Which is easy to remember because it is the reverse of our rule from phase 1.

I was only able to fight again on Monday, the 2nd of March, but thanks to all my preparation, I progressed swiftly. I joined a party that was labelled as fresh learning, but the players had actually seen up to adds before. With them, I was able to master the phase 1 mechanics in just a few pulls. While I was initially worried that the "Away with thee" teleport mechanic would be tricky to handle, Cairn was right. With some practice, it is actually quite doable. I play quite safe, and stop attacking early to aim the portal. I don't mind if I get a bad parse, as long as I can avoid killing my teammates and get the clear.

But the add phase is tough! You have to move the adds around in a circle while doing stack mechanics and dodging aoes, and the entire party even needs to teleport into a stack marker like this, it's quite rough.

I am convinced the dps check for the adds is harder than the dps check for the boss, and a single death here may result in failing it.

After 1 day, I had seen the final phase. Unusually for a 3rd boss, it has a form which is not present in normal mode, and Ryne and Gaia have a extra dialogue.

Click to showClick to hide

I went to bed satisfied, intending to make a serious effort to clear the next day. Could I achieve a week 2 clear? It would be far faster than anything I dreamed of, and just thinking of it made me excited.

However, the next day, Tuesday, was filled with problems. I joined a variety of parties, but people just kept running into various RL problems. Connection problems, router problems, it seemed as if fate was determined not to let anyone clear before reset. In 4 hours, I barely managed to see the final phase 3 times.

Finally, I found a good team, who produced strong DPS and was able to reliably clear adds. However, this team then ran into a different problem. There is a part where 4 DPS must stand in 4 towers with the appropriate debuff. PF standard is for the melee dps to take the front towers, and the ranged dps to take the back ones. But we had 3 ranged dps instead, which caused confusion.

We sorted it out eventually after a number of wipes, but by now time was running dangerously short. There was less than half an hour to weekly reset. At last we made it to the final phase! But a careless mistake wiped us there. Then on the next pull, I forgot to bait a mechanic during portals and wiped us again.

"Pull quick," my co-tank says. There are less than 12m left on the instance timer, only around 15m before weekly reset. I was determined to do colors correctly this time. I had thought about the solution for so long, all my preparation was for this critical moment. Everyone was tense, knowing that we had minutes to turn snatch back a victory.

I made a mistake. I moved early, and walked into the other players standing in their safe spot.

Overlapping opposite colored puddles like this is certain death.

The party was extremely gracious. They all said things like "it was a good attempt", "we did our best" etc. Not a single person blamed me, though I deserved all criticism.

If you play Savage long enough, you will make a mistake, wipe the party, and deny them the clear. But perhaps what separates winners from losers is whether you have the strength to get up and fight again.

Don't get bitter, just get better! Let's clear together next time!

Next: I Got The LAST Word! >>
Comments (8)

Mahdi Draaken

Faerie (Aether)

grats on prog. siggy!
you can do it!
I believe in you! \o/

Aala Konane

Midgardsormr (Aether)

You'll knock this out of the park soon enough!

Annabel Ashcroft

Faerie (Aether)

those charts gave me SUCH a headache! ;p

you FINALLY find a use for math and probability in the REAL world! LOL

Felsea Stryfe

Lich (Light)

All very true. My reclear took 3pulls. I caused 1st wipe and died on the clear my eating my own stepp doughnut lol. All very fun though. Now, remember how u said this would be harder. What u think now? I personally think it’s not harder. This Teir. My maybe it’s because personal gameplay has changed for me. I feel this in u too. Gg sigy

Raifur Almasyon

Spriggan (Chaos)

Good luck o/

*reads 'just get better'*

*big sigh*

Siglinde Skysworn

Sargatanas (Aether)

Thank you Mahdi, Aala, Felsea and Raifur, lol! You guys were right. In the end, I did kill it. (And I did get better too!)

Siglinde Skysworn

Sargatanas (Aether)

Felsea, I am still unsure about how the difficulty compares. Originally, thought it was actually easier.

However, some raiders told me you cannot think about it this way, since I am more experienced now compared to when I was doing Eden's Gate. Furthermore, the final stage is considered unusually hard, and I have not seen it yet. It's likely that it will turn out to be a greater challenge than Titan. Good luck on your journey too!

Siglinde Skysworn

Sargatanas (Aether)

Lol Anna! There is actually not any mathematics in this. It is logic and pattern recognition, and boiling down the mechanic into a set of simple rules to move.
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